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we'd been to the second air division a

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convention in McAfee in New York so we

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were slowly making our way back at a

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nice easy Pace we decided oh we wouldn't

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fly at night so I'd landed at Dayton for

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my first night stop and then at

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Albuquerque on the second night

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um our Grand Canyon really happened as a

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piece of luck because I was talking uh

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to the American Girl in air traffic at

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Albuquerque and she heard my English

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accent and she said oh I suppose you

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want to fly the canyon and I said well

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yes I I would like to do that so she

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advised us then that I should fly the

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canyon first and then land at Grand

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Canyon for fuel because if I went the

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other way around and landed at Grand

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Canyon and asked to fly the canyon I

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would possibly be told no so yes we had

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a look at the at Grand at the Grand

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Canyon itself but the incident happened

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I'd refueled at Grand Canyon airport I

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was just back up to my assigned height

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of 10 500 feet on the airway on Victor

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12 and we passed we passed over Lake

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Mead and I suppose we're about

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70 80 miles short of the Mojave Desert

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when it happened it began of course we

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both realized that there was something

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coming in our 12 o'clock at us at high

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speed very high speed which at that part

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of the world

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uh you're not used to them coming

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exactly head-on but obviously again I uh

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you know both of us had

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had the experience of a military jet

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coming at us at a different angle at

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speed so you uh you were quite used to

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seeing what in one second was a tiny

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Speck on the windshield and within a

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second was a very large airplane

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so you know we looked at it saw the spec

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coming but it came so quick when we

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first saw it we suddenly realized it was

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on top of us

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um so we pushed I pushed hard I was

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flying and David as my co-boy also

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pushed hard and we vanished as I say

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under the combing of the instrument

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panel we were convinced that that was it

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that we were going to have a mid-air

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that there'd be An Almighty bang on the

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tail would go and that would be it and

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that would and that would and that would

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be the end of our flying days

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um but I mean as I say bear in mind I

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was on the airway I was under a radar

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service and I had no warning of any

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conflicting traffic whatsoever but then

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of course that was when Graham it

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started to get very odd it went over the

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top of us a a large Shadow a very black

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shadow it darkened the whole of the

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pet and the sky above us of course was

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as I said was Clear Blue Sunshine

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um and we have any kind of Shockwave no

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no that was the funny thing there was no

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sound and there was no Shockwave

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whatsoever a little bit of turbulence

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but that could have been me pushing hard

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anyway my first concern was to get back

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up to my side height before somebody

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started to ask us to as to what I was

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doing

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um yes I I mean that was your instant

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reaction our other instant reaction was

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well you know thank goodness what

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happened there was a there was there was

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no bang it's mistus

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um so yeah it was uh it was

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I wouldn't say fear I I mean when it

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when it happened we were both convinced

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that we that we were going to have a

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mid-air because it came exactly at our

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12 o'clock we slowly came back up from

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under the combing I regained height and

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we both said what the heck was that

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um but then again the other mystery

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deepened I think because we both

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suddenly

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said that's there's something out to

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port on on my side of the airplane but

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we couldn't see anything and yet we both

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sensed that something was formatting on

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us something was moving it started out

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of the peripheral vision but certainly

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we it was such a strong feeling both of

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us were looking out my side of the

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airplane I think it was more than six

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cents I think we both both felt that

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whatever was there was moving so fast

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that the human eye couldn't actually

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register it in detail but could register

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that something was definitely moving we

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thought it was going you had a sensation

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it was going up and down beside us

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um but I'm in that sensation lasted so

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long and was so it was such an odd

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feeling and we were both convinced about

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it that uh I said to David as I say you

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know they say you fly the airplane

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because I've got my camera my still

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camera back in the back end of the

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airplane

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um so I had time to unstrap go back pick

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up my ordinary steel camera come back

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strap in and we both said it's still

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there so I took one picture and then

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they say we waited and then suddenly we

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both said it's it's there again we felt

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or sensed or could see a movement but we

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couldn't focus on it so I took a second

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picture

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um and I suppose that whole incident

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must have lasted for four minutes I

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suppose but that was so that was it was

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one of a one of a 36 exposure film of

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which we'd slowly taken most most of the

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shots on that film were of uh were of

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the canyon obviously

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um it had been sightseeing shots the

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first one had nothing on it and it was

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the second picture I think the reason

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why we definitely took two was because

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we felt you know because we felt there

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was something interesting happening we

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wanted to have at least a second or a

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third shot maybe I should have taken

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three four five six but we wanted to

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check that there was nothing in the

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cockpit like uh say an oxygen mask or

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anything else that was showing a

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reflection on that side window and as

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you saw from from the first picture

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there is absolutely nothing that could

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about three days later we went to a

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party at the U.S naval base at Treasure

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Island and I took the photographs as I

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say there and uh the U.S Navy officer

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asked if he could if he could keep them

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for three days and I said yes as as long

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as I can definitely have them back

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before I go back to the senior Navy

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officer

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I think he was a he was a hmm I think he

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was a lieutenant so I know he wasn't he

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you know he possibly wasn't

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he was about middle to say middle

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ranking yeah as I said I've forgotten

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his name now but but again after three

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days when we went back to Treasure

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Island

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um and he produced my photographs uh but

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uh he just wouldn't give us anything it

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was no comment and we said well come on

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surely you can give us something else to

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say what as I said what do you actually

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think it was no comment um I mean

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whether it was whether it was because he

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genuinely didn't know what it was or

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whether in which case why couldn't he

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tell you yeah or he quite quite quite

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later on in the evening when on that

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evening when we went back to pick them

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up we were talking to a U.S naval pilot

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and he was looking at the picture and of

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course he said well I can tell you what

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are the whiteness over the top is I say

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that is vapor caused by a rapid rate of

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climb which we could obviously

182
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understand that and we thought well yes

183
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that could make sense oh that makes

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sense no I mean I suppose to be honest

185
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it was semi-visible in other words it

186
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was moving at a speed where your human

187
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eye could sense movement but it couldn't

188
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focus on it but we were lucky enough on

189
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one shot the camera actually caught it

190
00:07:23,749 --> 00:07:20,880
blurred but it caught it so I mean it

191
00:07:25,790 --> 00:07:23,759
certainly was a a flying object it was

192
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certainly was unidentified

193
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um but it was it was definitely there

194
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and it was solid

195
00:07:34,189 --> 00:07:31,979
um but the rest of it remains a mystery

196
00:07:37,550 --> 00:07:34,199
although as Pilots I suppose at the same

197
00:07:40,790 --> 00:07:37,560
one accepts that yes there are UFOs

198
00:07:43,550 --> 00:07:40,800
and I think ah our picture proved it I

199
00:07:45,890 --> 00:07:43,560
think certainly I mean of all the and on

200
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that trip back we were making a a

201
00:07:50,270 --> 00:07:48,419
widescreen story uh but I mean and and

202
00:07:52,909 --> 00:07:50,280
that picture actually features in it but

203
00:07:54,589 --> 00:07:52,919
uh nobody has ever queried it and I

204
00:07:57,529 --> 00:07:54,599
think mainly because you can say well

205
00:08:00,170 --> 00:07:57,539
you know I have the picture so I know

206
00:08:02,510 --> 00:08:00,180
what I saw I proved what I saw

207
00:08:04,550 --> 00:08:02,520
um I can prove it here is so here is the

208
00:08:06,890 --> 00:08:04,560
photograph but it still remains a

209
00:08:09,650 --> 00:08:06,900
mystery nobody has ever explained to us

210
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as to as to why there was no sound why

211
00:08:16,610 --> 00:08:13,319
there was no no airflow or turbulence

212
00:08:18,950 --> 00:08:16,620
um or and why we couldn't actually focus

213
00:08:21,469 --> 00:08:18,960
on it why it didn't come and hover

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00:08:24,050 --> 00:08:21,479
beside us and say stop still so we could

215
00:08:26,510 --> 00:08:24,060
actually see it in detail nobody's ever

216
00:08:28,490 --> 00:08:26,520
explained that until it's Graham at all

217
00:08:30,950 --> 00:08:28,500
although some of your some of your

218
00:08:33,370 --> 00:08:30,960
pictures are the analysis is intriguing

219
00:08:36,649 --> 00:08:33,380
I think of that photograph